Community Q&A: Armor System and Balancing
- Originally Posted by bmfof: Can we get an explanation on how exactly will the new armor system works, with actual examples?
- Originally Posted by Melkorus: Can you provide us with real and factual examples of prestige class AND specialized armor?
We can talk about the goals we had creating the new armor and specialization system:
- More diversity: There shouldn’t be a single role (e.g., hybrid) that dominates all others. Our goal was to make all roles viable in PvP. A player that wants to be a fighter, for example, should have a fair chance to win versus a mage.
- Reduce the power gap: it shouldn’t take a very long time to be viable in PvP. If a player focuses on a single role, he should be able to excel in that role in a specific time-frame. A more experienced player could be able to excel in multiple roles but he will not be able to utilize all of them simultaneously. This will help level the playing field.
- Consistency with basic Darkfall principles: players will still be able to freely select, change and combine roles. The difference now is that there are trade-offs: each choice will have a consequence; each advantage will also have a disadvantage.
Your play-style depends on the type of armor you have on and on the main base attribute that you choose to boost with specific title enhancements. Getting titles, how you use them, and how they work is different than it is today.
There will be distinct play styles, among them obvious ones such as melee, archer, magic, but there are also more like for example being a defensive tank. Hybridization will be possible by wearing a type of armor (heavy,medium,robe) and mixing a base attribute to boost e.g. medium armor + strength might work out for a one handed weapon and archery hybrid.
You will be able to boost one base attribute past its current limit through the title. There is a prerequisite base attribute value for usage of armors and weapons. Armor types block opposing spells and/or skills and/or special skills.
We are also experimenting with special exception slots where you could select one of the blocked skills or spells to become available in your arsenal. Of course this wouldn’t work at the magnitude it would for a fully specialized character. Each play-style might also be enhanced with new special abilities and skills in order to be viable against other styles.
BALANCING
A lot of spells and relevant skills, also passive skills/spells will be gone. Magic schools are completely redesigned by moving spells around, re-balancing their strength and usage and adding new spells. There are now distinct roles for specific magic schools.
- Originally Posted by bobii: Is the staff magnitude-to-damage scaling ever going to get fixed?
- Yes, it’s fixed as a part of the overall balance work we’ve been doing for the game.
- Originally Posted by Bomanz: You have stated nearly a year ago (see my question in the last Q &A) that a game wide balance evaluation was being conducted, examining the above issues. What are the conclusions of this evaluation, and are we going to see this content balanced and made useful in the next expansion?
- Most of the work done on the overall balance is based on information from the evaluation you mention concluded back then. There have been more evaluations since then taking into account parts of the game that have changed, and these have been taken into consideration during the overall re-balancing of the game.
- Originally Posted by screw loose: What are your views on Wall of Force, fire knock-ups, and bunny-hopping?
- We like physics in Darkfall and the freedom they give players to find fun and interesting ways of using them. We also think that some mechanics like bunny-hopping should be adjusted: It’s a fun way of using physics but we never intended for players on foot to be able to keep up with mounts. All three of the points mentioned in the question above are being rebalanced.
- Originally Posted by Sarphus: A while ago an AV rep said there would be new spells in the expansion. Can we have some examples?
- We’ll get back to you on this with a proper presentation for the new spells. Please allow us to skirt the question for the time being.
- Originally Posted by bongloads: Fire has been the premiere elemental spell-circle choice since launch. It used to be the only spell circle with complete animations and it also did the most damage, now it’s the only elemental with secondary effects (air’s gimped version of knockup doesn’t count… it’s an ineffectively scaled copy-paste of fire; it barely does anything). Are there any plans to attempt to balance elemental spell schools, by adding secondary effects to water, fire, lightning
- Yes, absolutely. We’ve given value to all the schools, each has its’ role in the game. As we mention above, spells are more distinct, more specialized and more role-focused than before.
- Originally Posted by MillionAlts: Will the farming to fighting ratio ever be addressed? Not necessarily for the best gear, but many players feel that the ratio is way out for “everyday / every player” gear
- Yes, this is a big part of what we have been working on. Redistributing of locations, quest rewards, loot, all these points and more are being changed with this concern in mind. The goal is to considerably reduce the daily prep time for your character to join the action.
- Originally Posted by Trismagistus: Do you have a time-frame when some of the spells in game will be readdressed such as healing chant, tornado, arcane damage, and earthquake for usefulness?
- When the overall balancing will start being implemented. All spells have been readdressed. We’re trying to get prioritized items into the game as soon as possible, as they become available.
- Originally Posted by schlock: Will one-handed melee ever be viable? If so, how do you plan on doing that? We feel that the balance and importance between the different play styles is not like we want them to be.
- We spoke above on the armor specialization. You can excel at using one-handed melee to the point where you should be able to compete with other play-styles. Combined with a shield and a new mechanic for blocking , you will be very viable within the constraints of the melee specialty, since there are trade-offs to be made.
- Originally Posted by Liquid20: When will you balance the melee weapons so that they are all viable? Currently, 90% of the server uses greatswords.
- Like the spells, every weapon type has been rebalanced.
- Originally Posted by Darkfiend#billy: Right now, the magic system is developed in a way that your character must master multiple schools in order to be competitive in PvP encounters. Are there any plans to make deep specializations in one specific school (possibly via prestige classes) such as Earth/Fire/Air/Water mage to add diversity and particular focus into one school of magic at the expense of others?
- This is being looked at. For the time being we’re working on properly balancing all the schools and spells. You can still specialize as a support or an offensive mage by boosting your wisdom or your intelligence respectively.
Thank you. Are the “Titles” you refer to in place of Prestige Classes? Are Prestige Classes = extra attribute numbers? If so, this seems EXTREMELY weak. Where is the Paladin’s full heal once per day with half his gold going to the church?
You did not use the word prestige ANYWHERE in this posting in any of the answers. Are you avoiding the answer?
That’s obviously not there anymore. That half gold to the church thing was from an interview in like, 2005/6…
If you want prestige classes so bad go play Horizons.
Awesome post on the upcoming DF2010 changes.
to bad it got delayed to Early Q2 2011. fully understandable though.
i truly hope to see it in action Early Q2.
[/sarcasm]
Very good update.
Fantastic, thank you!
nice to hear nothing new!
1h weapon love!
Finally!
Man, I hope we get to use and test this live before the relaunch.
Excellent update!
Thank you so much Aventurine for this! It’s what we’ve been asking for!!!!
-Kasmos
thank you for this update
Making a full loot version of WOW with classes and maxing out character in 3 months would be a disaster.
We dont want restrictions we want pvp balance.
These changes if implemented in the ususal AV manner will result in the death of DF.
I disagree. I think if done correctly (and it looks like Aventurine is seriously addressing all of these things, even though it’s taking a long time, very carefully and cautiously) it could be the revitalization of this game.
Again Aventurine, thank you so much for this update.
-Kasmos
I don’t know how you revitalize a dead game. For them to start revitalizing, they need to start incrementally putting this stuff in now, with smaller and more frequent patches. Waiting for another 6 months for Arena will kill DF.
The is not dead, but it certainly isn’t populated enough.
And they said in this Q&A “We’re trying to get prioritized items into the game as soon as possible, as they become available.”
We already know the siege system is about 3-4 weeks away (or so we’ve been told).
Thanks for this update. It gives us back all some hope but this will be gone unless we finally see some REAL changes in game.
Let’s hope it’s soon…
…™
Approve
This still sounds more like concept, not “almost ready to be patched in” features. With already missed ETA and no new one … kinda disappointing.
Awesome update!
We just need some patching asap.
BOOOOO DOESN’T tell me anything I didn’t already know/assume. GIVE ME SOME NUMBERS! AND A FUCKING ETA
Thank you Av, good job
I really appreciate you AV, for answering some of the communities questions. But we still haven’t had an answer on the biggest question of all:
When is this going to happen? Whats the new ETA for DF: Arena? Be brutally honest if you have to and say we had to wipe the whole idea and start over and it won’t happen til 2012!
Some news is better than no news…
These changes sound great! I’m really happy at where this game is headed.
Everything already known and how to fix it. 1000 of suggestions in the forum. for example the character thing was said as soon as everyone saw the hybrid thing doesnt work ( why did you removed the spell school thing at release ?).
The main Question is : Release 2000when ?
Great update. I think the reason they don’t release more information is because none of the upcoming changes have been finalised. The framework has been done but its not finished. If they release an update and then find something needs major changes they will be accused of lying.
I think what has happened is they were going to release the Sound updates in a patch, and then the UI and so on, but they discovered that the whole game needed a major overhall to put these changes in properly. This is a relaunch because it will be a completely rewritten game. New UI, updated graphics and sound engine, total revamp of all models and animation and significant changes to the balance and mechanics of the game. They all have to come at once because they are all interconnected. Its like an artist releasing pictures of a painting when he is only halfway through, even though he has a good idea of what he wants, he won’t be sure until he’s finihed.
AV’s biggest problem is they have one of the biggest worlds with one of the smallest MMO companies running it
AV’s be carefull, doing this. Be carefull, because following trolls and whiners is a popular mistake, that being done by lot’s of game developers.
The last game where same happen was warhamemr online. The were making game step by step more casual and easy. First, who left the game – was hardcore players, because the game because too easy and the game was similar to couner strike – everyone was similar with everyone. Than the game left casual players, because there was nothing to do and no challenge without hardcore gamers.
Than the game die. It down from 30 to 3 servers with overall popularity 800.
Please. Be carefull doing this. I came this game, because it was hard and interesting. If it will be a casual nothing, where i could surge all spells for 1 day\1 week, i will leave this game. Because it will be a CS.
With these titles I’m hoping you don’t have to go into a Blue city to get them. Hoping you will make it so we can get them in clan cities or chaos cities as to make it possible for Reds to Acquire them.
A lot of spells and relevant skills, also passive skills/spells will be gone.
Does that mean Mana Conservation, Focus, Fitness, Endurance, ArchMage and Reagent Conservation all will be gone ? I worked so hard to max those specially MC and now they just be gone ? Can someone please clarify this !
I don’t expect they will reset the server because they really won’t need to. When the gap between new players and veterans is closed (via not being able to use everything all the time to full effect), the time it takes for a new player “paper-wise” to match a veteran won’t be a turn-off. Instead, it will be a short-term goal, and the long-term goal is to build a versatile character that can effectively change between styles. Where new players will struggle most is matching a veterans knowledge of combat situations, mastery of item selection, and other little things that come with playing the game a lot.
Don’t forget that whole other layers of the game exist like politics, who you know, and what your big goals are (building a naval fleet, empire expansion, mercenary work, etc.) There will be a lot more to being a veteran in Darkfall in the future than just having high stats and every skill.
TL;DR: Don’t expect a server reset. At most, Darkfall will grow and new servers will come with it.
basical this say:
DF morph to DF2
i was afraid they dont change enought
that fear is gone now
GREAT NEWS!
important DEV feedback:
give us a meaning of play the game now
because after reading this news i got the feeling playing/skilling now make no sence because u cant keep anything
make clear that we keep skills and attributes and we will still save lot tuime or give us a headstart in DF2 if we finish our charakter pre expansion
This is what I want to know. I’m unsubbed, but I’ve been thinking of going back (as I do every few months). But with this information, I don’t want to grind gold and meditate on useless attributes.
And I dread having to go reset my UI again from the beginning. When is the UI revision coming?
I missed this but i have a very very very important question!!!!!!
Will you ever change the game mechanics like surges and fizzles???
Clone Wars is finished. Thank you AV
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quite frankly, this report raises more questions rather than answers; an example would help more.
As one of the 1% that plays this game for the PVE, I greatly approve of the one-handed, “tank”. i love this games playstyle so much i realy dont see how they could change this game to “kill” it. if you feel this way i think you are only playing this game for 60% of the total worth. and that would be to kill someone else playing the game… i however have no interest in killing Newbz farming goblins and raiding cities…. give me a bow and dragon and ill have fun!
nice post! I just hope we see some changes soon.
so wich spells/skils/abilities going to be removed?? im in the proccess of leveling Magic..i will be very pissed if i max many things that later will be completely scratched… at least u must tell us that so we avoid those spells/skills and be more focused on other skills that is going to stay later on…
FINALLY the news i have been waiting one and a half months for.
Does this mean you’ll remove archmage and mana convervation (for example)? Release patch notes to inform people about it if that’s the case. They shouldn’t have to waste time leveling those skills if they’re going to end up getting removed…
Isn’t it easier to calculate for each skill a certain value in points. And when the relaunch takes place, just reset all skills and give the players the points to distribute them as they see fit.
Just my opinion.
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Ok, ok, very nice…
…so, now do you have a date to release that
This is great and all … but the last question is ….
WHEN is this all going to happen?
When it’s done..
Nice but when?
nice update, now actually DO SOMETHING with it.
ok, really AV. ur going to make us w8 forever for the expansion and then decide to get ride of half the shit people have spent months and months and even years to get. u are a flies ass away from killing this game 100%. simply put add things DO NOT take them away.
SORRY FOR USING CAPS I JUST NEEDED SOME ATTENTION. I’VE BEEN PLAYING THIS GAME SINCE CLOSED BETA, WITH SOME BREAKS EVERY NOW AND THEN. MOST OF MY FRIENDS QUIT THIS GAME BECAUSE OF THE TIME TO BECOME PVP VIABLE, PREP TIME FOR PVP AND BALANCING (ARCHETYPE) ISSUES. THIS SHOULD BE YOUR HIGHEST PRIORITY, I’VE BEEN WAITING FOR CHANGES LIKE THIS SINCE 09″. ALL THESE CHANGES ARE JUST PERFECT AND I COULDN’T BELIEVE MY EYES THAT YOU GUYS ACTUALLY TALKED ABOUT ALL THESE PROBLEMS FOR ONCE AND SAID YOU WERE GOING TO FIX THEM. PLEASE MAKE IT YOUR HIGHEST PRIORITY! THIS IS YOUR BEST BLOG POST!!!
I greatly dislike the concept of specific armors disallowing certain schools of magic – it feels and seems absolutely stupid. If they really honestly wanted to make armor more important against magic and remove the “perfection” of a magic/melee hybrid then they should instead focus on retooling and rebalancing the Encumberance system. By tweaking the amount of Magic Encumberance pieces of armor have you dramatically change the effectiveness of spellcasting. You could also change fizzles to be a % chance dependant on your uncompensated Magic Encumberance, making spellcasters with high encumberance pratically ineffective. By also making Magic Encumberance affect your casting time, spell cost (in mana, hp, or stamina, not reagents), and spell effect more dramatically you’d also cut down on heavy-wearing melee/magic hybrids. By reducing the effect of the Encumberance Bonus enchantment you’d also get a more rounded character.
Also, let’s try adding some width and depth to the Melee/Archery upgrades, and if you want some pure-casters, add some Magic Upgrades (not spell upgrades – those are fine where they are). For example, have some Magic Upgrades that while in robes and with a staff equipped you gain some bonus (melee protections, extra Int, bigger AoEs, ect), and move Mana Shield from Archery with Bow to Magic with Staff.
You didn’t answer the most important question: WHEN ?
All other answers have been told before….